Pittsburgh Sports Report - Up-Close with PSR: Sonny Vaccaro

Pittsburgh Sports Report
March 2005

Up-Close with PSR
Sonny Vaccaro

[Read the entire interview below]

The name Sonny Vaccaro is synonymous with college basketball. The 65-year old native of Trafford, Pa. has been called a sports marketing genius, a champion of youth basketball, a shoe huckster, and the “Last Don” by ESPN the Magazine – among other things. Whatever you call him, Vaccaro is one of the most formidable forces in contemporary basketball. He has founded some of the most renowned and respected grassroots basketball programs in the country: the ABCD Camp, Big Time Tournament and the EA Sports Roundball Classic (formerly the Dapper Dan Roundball Classic), which originated in Pittsburgh. Vaccaro joined forces with Nike’s Phil Knight in 1978 and helped put them on the map with the Nike Air Jordan shoe line. After spending nearly a decade with adidas (during which time he signed Kobe Bryant to the company), Vaccaro joined Reebok in 2003. PSR editor Tony DeFazio caught up with Vaccaro to talk basketball in Pittsburgh and look back on his time in the shoe business.

PSR: Why has high school basketball in Pittsburgh experienced such a dramatic downfall since the sixties?

Sonny: In the 1960s and 70s we had as many great players from the Pittsburgh area as anywhere – and the fact that the Roundball Classic for many years was Pennsylvania against the rest of the world attests to that. There’s no logical reason other than Pittsburgh’s interests have changed. The City League isn’t what it used to be. Back then, if you played in the City League, you were almost born to be a great basketball player. The Schenley guys like Kenny Durrett, Petie Gibson and Maurice Lucas. Going out even into the suburbs, the Rankins and the Braddocks, you had Billy Knight, and players even out in Ambridge and Aliquippa. You don’t have that anymore.

I’m still as involved today as I was 41 years ago and there’s just nothing there. There’s absolutely nothing. The best player in western Pennsylvania is Ben McCauley, and he’s a really good player. But he isn’t the standard of a Wally Walker or a Gus Gerard or guys like that (both Walker and Gerard played for the University of Virginia and each played several season in the NBA). There’s just been a drop-off.

I think it’s competitiveness. In the old days, when I used to take the various teams around to play in different tournaments, kids really lived for the postseason tournaments, like the Hoyle and the Roundball, after the state tournament. So I don’t know if it’s the parents and the genes aren’t working or what, but there is a difference. There is no question. Pittsburgh has some of the lowest high-quality major basketball players in America.

PSR: Recently, there has been an effort to create resurgence in the quality of high school basketball in Pittsburgh. Has there been any progress so far?

SV: There has been some. Johnny Giammarco is a guy who has been around for a long time and who has done some good things. There are other people in the city now who are trying to make it, and some of the AAU teams like the Pittsburgh Jots have been successful traveling America. There have been some individual people, like the kid who transferred to Shaler from Altoona, Danny Fortson.

What’s happened, though, is there just isn’t any competition. There’s nothing there that makes these kids want to play all the time. It’s hard to explain the impact of the Roundball or the City Catholic Game from the 60s and the 70s. Those were things that the kids looked forward to. There’s nothing for them to look forward to today.

Maybe someone can start this rebirth and get it going again. I can’t believe that Pittsburgh just doesn’t have kids who can’t play basketball.

PSR: The athletes seem to be here. College football and women’s basketball certainly have a fertile recruiting ground in this area. Why has talent in football and men’s and women’s basketball been mutually exclusive in Pittsburgh lately?

SV: They shouldn’t be. I think once these kids start playing in competitive environments, and start playing games and tournaments nationally, they’ll be enthusiasm again. I just haven’t seen it happen yet.

I think there can be a rebirth. I know that the town’s ready. I think that the success of Pitt should have added a lot to some of the rebirth here. There are some great facilities. Since I’ve been gone they’ve added some really attractive facilities, even at some of the outlying colleges.

I think it can happen again. You know, I’m watching Michigan play in the Rose Bowl and there are 3-4 Pittsburgh kids on the field. So football has not experienced the drop-off.

PSR: If Pitt can continue to win at a high level, can Pittsburgh become a good basketball town?

SV: Yeah I think it can. I think that Jamie (Dixon) has got to help. Pitt’s got to help the undergrowth there. Whether it’s through camps or whether it’s through Jamie speaking, I think it can happen. I think Pitt can help. The kids gotta want it though.

PSR: Can Pitt sustain their current success? Is this a perennial top 25, top 20, top 10 program?

SV: I think they can be a top 20 team the rest of their life because Jamie’s too good at this, and he has a very good staff and they’ve really got it going. Once you get it going in basketball it makes it easier. The hardest part is that they’ve got to go to New York or Ohio or some other place to get kids to come here. So it’s not a bad place to come, but every other place in the Big East, with the exception of West Virginia, has somebody in the area. Mom and Dad can drive and see the game at night. And that’s a big thing.

PSR: Is Jamie Dixon a long term fit at Pitt?

SV: I think so. I really do. I think he’s found his niche and he’s going to be successful. He’s going to get offers because they’re always going to be a top 20 team. And they’re going to get the kids from New York until St. John’s gets it right again. Now, if they get it right again that’ll cut off the avenue that Pitt has been able to put in there. But they’ve been going in there and doing some great, great things. Chris Taft was a major coup, but we didn’t really know how good Chris was.

But the only other real option for Jamie is to come back to the west coast, and they’ve filled the Southern Cal job, and Ben’s not leaving UCLA for a long time. So those are the other things you have to think of.

PSR: Some critics say that shoe companies have entirely too much power in college basketball – do you agree with that sentiment?

SV: Some people ought to be quiet and thank the shoe companies for making basketball a premier sport…

We’ve basically supported every major program, we support every major youth league in America, we provide the kids with the summer camps and the competition to go to them, and we subsidize high schools. I mean, people who say that are really short-sighted and have no real connection to the game.

The only thing these people see when they look at a shoe company is a catch-phrase. But again, you can’t deny the shoe companies’ support of basketball, from the NBA to college level and on down. I mean, Pitt’s got a deal with adidas for football and basketball, and it’s a lot of money they save. That’s how they pay Jamie’s salary.

The shoe companies are the sugar daddy of the basketball world. People might laugh when they hear that, but they’re okay when they watch the Tostitos’ Fiesta Bowl and the Fed Ex Orange Bowl. These are companies who have nothing to do with sports, other than to put a label on the back of these kids.

At least the shoe companies are involved in it. I mean, we sell the shoes…we sell the product that the kids who are playing the sport wear.

So I resent that. It’s coming from very short-sighted, biased human beings. I’ve been in a whirlpool of accusations all my life, so I can withstand that. But without the shoe companies, basketball as we know it simply wouldn’t exist.

Look at my life, or at least from 1965 to 2005. I’m not saying I created all this, I’m just saying that as I bounce through this world, hell, all of the things have gotten better in college basketball. Hell, no one cared what college basketball was in the 60s. The WPIAL was bigger than Pitt basketball in 1965, let’s be honest. Schenley High School was better than Pitt.

Let’s be very honest here: they didn’t start televising the NBA Finals until 1980, after Magic and Larry. People may forget the tape-delayed games. And then after all these young kids that we helped make names for start going to the colleges, CBS comes in and gives them a $6 billion deal. I mean, we subsidized this. I started subsidizing universities with Nike in ’85 with the University of Miami. We bought the whole darn school their shoes.

It’s been better because of the shoe companies. A few small people seem to think that it isn’t. But the other thing that riles people is my being able to do things. I definitely helped Ben go to Pittsburgh, but that was a smart call by Steve Pederson because Ben deserved it. And the shoe companies basically subsidize the coaches’ salaries too.

But what I’ve been doing, I’ve been at a helluva lot longer than the shoe companies have been involved. But my point to you is, thank God for the shoe companies.

PSR: You’ve made a huge imprint on amateur basketball in the United States over the past few decades – what would you like your legacy to be?

SV: My legacy will be the kids I became involved with over the last 41 years. When I look at my life, I really never gave into the media or the hierarchy or the NCAA or whoever else. I sort of lived my live that way.

But all the kids over 41 years, basically without ever having to give me a paycheck, they gave me a great life. So that’s what it is – it’s people, after you’re gone. They don’t have to put monuments up, they just have to say, “You know what? That Sonny was a pretty good guy.” That’s fine with me.